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Post by Ian Noble on Sept 1, 2010 19:13:10 GMT
Andrew Bynum is not a top five center in the league. Your trading a top ten statistical player for someone who can barely finish a season without a major injury. You getting no proven players here, just the hope that Bynum turns out to be as good as every says he can be. He's your franchise player and your trading him for basically prospects. Just the one prospect and a bag of meaty filler imho.
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Post by Bryan Colangelo on Sept 1, 2010 19:22:38 GMT
You really can't call Andrew Bynum a prospect at all his a proven center yeah he gets hurt but his only 21 years old I can see coming up Chris Bosh is going to be getting at least 16 ppg this year thats it you guys have to think on a team with Leborn and Wade he wont get the touches his got when he was on the Raptors
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Post by Willis Reed on Sept 1, 2010 19:29:38 GMT
But stats don't define ratings. If Bosh puts up 16 and 8 we shouldn't lower his rating. Same thing with LeBron and Wade, Bron will probably have stats somewhere around 23ppg, 7apg, 6rpg, that doesn't mean we should make him like a 90, he will still be the best all-around player on the planet.
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Post by Mitch Kupchak on Sept 1, 2010 19:30:27 GMT
kills a team? -- Bynum is 21? How can he kill a team??? Tell me 4 Centers who are better than him...btw he has a great 4 year contract... Dwight Howard Yao Ming Horford LBJ (He can play any position) yao was better than bynum, now i take bynum over yao any day... Horford? he is a a good PF but no real center! LBJ? are u kidding me? he is insane but no center... for real...the only better real Centers are Dwight Howard and maybe Brook Lopez, but thats it!!! and there u see there are no many good Centers...Bynum is on top of the list with 21! Prospect? u serious? DeMarcus Cousins is a prospect... Bynum puts up 15 points and 8,4 boards and 1,8 blk in just 30 minutes in a team with Kobe and Gasol!!! Thats 20+ points 11+ boards and 2,4 blocks in 40 minutes in a team - I WRITE IT AGAIN - with Kobe and Gasol!!!not to mention 57% field goal % for real if been in so many sim leagues...if this fair trade doesnt go through you can discuss every trade off
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Post by Chris Webber on Sept 1, 2010 19:31:40 GMT
That has nothing to do with how valuable he is to the Raptors. He'll only get like 16 a game with the heat because he is playing with two all stars. Andrew is still considered a prospect as people still talk about his potential. He is is injury prone and you can't build your team around somebody like him until he proves that he can carry a team on his back. Bosh is more valuable to the Raptors than any other team in this league because the team is built around him.
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Post by Bryan Colangelo on Sept 1, 2010 19:52:25 GMT
Man i guess you don't watch the Raptors at all because yeah they where built around him but they can do a lot without him too and there going to prove it this year Andrew is a guy I like a guy i would built a team around no but what I was getting offered was nothing I could built around so i look at the guys I have on my team right now and built around that And Andrew is going to be a great fit on this team
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Post by Charles Barkley on Sept 1, 2010 21:43:04 GMT
Dwight Howard Yao Ming Horford LBJ (He can play any position) yao was better than bynum, now i take bynum over yao any day... Horford? he is a a good PF but no real center! LBJ? are u kidding me? he is insane but no center... for real...the only better real Centers are Dwight Howard and maybe Brook Lopez, but thats it!!! and there u see there are no many good Centers...Bynum is on top of the list with 21! Prospect? u serious? DeMarcus Cousins is a prospect... Bynum puts up 15 points and 8,4 boards and 1,8 blk in just 30 minutes in a team with Kobe and Gasol!!! Thats 20+ points 11+ boards and 2,4 blocks in 40 minutes in a team - I WRITE IT AGAIN - with Kobe and Gasol!!!not to mention 57% field goal % for real if been in so many sim leagues...if this fair trade doesnt go through you can discuss every trade offMing, Howard, Lopez, Marc Gasol and Bogut all are by far better centers than Bynum. Also you could consider some "tweeners" there, then Duncan, Horford, Pau Gasol all are much better than him as well (all 3 have played significant minutes at the center spot). As for my personal preferences, I would rate Oden higher than him, but he has the same issues as Bynum (injuries). But I have to agree with that he would be great playing in Toronto next to Bargnani, I think they could work really well there.
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Post by sniper on Sept 1, 2010 22:28:48 GMT
Andrew Bynum is way way way too overrated.
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Post by George Gervin on Sept 1, 2010 23:35:52 GMT
Mr. Barkley please explain to me how Bogut is that much better then Bynum. Bogut played 69 games, Bynum 65 games. here's their stats from last season. sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/stats?playerId=2747Bogut sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/stats?playerId=2748Bynum PPG: Bogut 15.9, Bynum 15 RPG: Bogut 10.2, Bynum 8.3 APG: Bogut 1.8, Bynum 1.0 BPG: Bogut 2.50, Bynum 1.40 SPG: Bogut 0.60, Bynum 0.50 FG: Bogut .520, Bynum .570 FT: Bogut .629, Bynum .739 MIN: Bogut 32.3, Bynum 30.4 FGA: Bogut 6.9-13.2, Bynum 6.0-10.6 OH BTW, Bogut put those numbers up AS THE MAN ON HIS TEAM, while Bynum put those numbers up AS THE NUMBER THREE OPTION ON THOSE TEAMS (behind Kobe and Gasol). Also stop making Bosh look much better then he really is, he plays zero defense and on a european style run and gun team he got to pad his stats. BTW, Bynum toughed it out threw his injury while Bosh didn't, Bynum was hurt for 2 consecutive playoffs now with a bad knee, but still toughed it out. While the real life Bryan Colangelo had to say this about Mr. Bosh articles.sun-sentinel.com/2010-07-27/sports/sfl-bosh-slamed-0727_1_general-manager-bryan-colangelo-raptors-gm-chris-boshLet's see, what's worse a elbow to the face, or your knee being ****ed up for 3 years in a row. To finish it off, the LAKERS WERE IN FIRST PLACE WITH BYNUM AS THE NUMBER TWO OPTION in 07-08, BEFORE HE GOT HURT. www.associatedcontent.com/article/542785/andrew_bynums_injury_could_ruin_the.html
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Post by George Gervin on Sept 1, 2010 23:36:40 GMT
As of January 15, 2008, the Los Angeles Lakers stand in first place in the Western Conference standings. Now, it is a virtual tie at the top, but should the season have ended on that day, they would have had the number one seed in the West. It is highly unlikely that the Lakers would have maintained that position as number one in the West even if Andrew Bynum had not gone down with his kneecap injury. However, it is safe to say they had a great chance at maintaining a spot as top four team in the West, thereby allotting them home court advantage in the first round of the playoffs. That's from the above link.
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Post by Chris Webber on Sept 1, 2010 23:39:07 GMT
Bynum could only put up those numbers as the number three option. Meaning he was usually open as Kobe and Gasol get DOUBLED. He would not average more than what he did this year as the number one option on a team as defenses would be able to just zero in on him.
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Post by George Gervin on Sept 1, 2010 23:40:35 GMT
The only guys you can argue being better then Bynum at CENTER is Howard, Duncan, and maybe Yao (but if Bynum is getting downgraded for his injuries how about Yao Ming then, he gets hurt a lot too).
Horford, Bogut, Gasol (he might become better then Bynum soon though), and Lopez are not better then Bynum right now.
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Post by George Gervin on Sept 1, 2010 23:45:47 GMT
Bynum could only put up those numbers as the number three option. Meaning he was usually open as Kobe and Gasol get DOUBLED. He would not average more than what he did this year as the number one option on a team as defenses would be able to just zero in on him. If we go by that logic then Rondo should be able to put up 20 and 15, and Perkins 18 and 11 no problem, because teams are focusing more on Garnett, Pierce, Allen. Same goes for Artest and Odom they should put up much better numbers then they did, everyone's focused on Kobe, Gasol, and Bynum. BTW please do not think of this as an aggressive debate from my end, I am basically counter-arguing everyone's points about Bynum's value that's all.
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Post by Charles Barkley on Sept 2, 2010 17:47:00 GMT
Mr. Barkley please explain to me how Bogut is that much better then Bynum. Bogut played 69 games, Bynum 65 games. here's their stats from last season. sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/stats?playerId=2747Bogut sports.espn.go.com/nba/players/stats?playerId=2748Bynum PPG: Bogut 15.9, Bynum 15 RPG: Bogut 10.2, Bynum 8.3 APG: Bogut 1.8, Bynum 1.0 BPG: Bogut 2.50, Bynum 1.40 SPG: Bogut 0.60, Bynum 0.50 FG: Bogut .520, Bynum .570 FT: Bogut .629, Bynum .739 MIN: Bogut 32.3, Bynum 30.4 FGA: Bogut 6.9-13.2, Bynum 6.0-10.6 OH BTW, Bogut put those numbers up AS THE MAN ON HIS TEAM, while Bynum put those numbers up AS THE NUMBER THREE OPTION ON THOSE TEAMS (behind Kobe and Gasol). Also stop making Bosh look much better then he really is, he plays zero defense and on a european style run and gun team he got to pad his stats. BTW, Bynum toughed it out threw his injury while Bosh didn't, Bynum was hurt for 2 consecutive playoffs now with a bad knee, but still toughed it out. While the real life Bryan Colangelo had to say this about Mr. Bosh articles.sun-sentinel.com/2010-07-27/sports/sfl-bosh-slamed-0727_1_general-manager-bryan-colangelo-raptors-gm-chris-boshLet's see, what's worse a elbow to the face, or your knee being ****ed up for 3 years in a row. To finish it off, the LAKERS WERE IN FIRST PLACE WITH BYNUM AS THE NUMBER TWO OPTION in 07-08, BEFORE HE GOT HURT. www.associatedcontent.com/article/542785/andrew_bynums_injury_could_ruin_the.htmlI have to admit that I exaggarated, when I said, those players are by far better. They all are better still. Neither are close to franchise players, but you can count on them as 2-3rd option. As for the reasons Bogut better than Bynum: * Better passer * Better at defense (including shot blocking). It's not that Bynum isn't great at defense, just Bogut is better (actually there's a stat to prove this, Bogut was ranked 2nd next to Howard, while Bynum was 17th) * There isn't very much difference, but Bogut has been healthier, both have been off the court due injuries for some time during their careers, averaging 10 more games per season. * I have to say Bynum is more efficient scorer indeed. * Not by a large margin, but Bogut turns the ball over less than Bynum (11.4% to 12.5%) Overall the difference isn't very large, but Bogut is a better player. But I have question for you, why you do this deal anyway as you are dealing a top 4 center, who is only 22 for this pansy ass stat padder Bosh like you're saying?
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Post by Willis Reed on Sept 2, 2010 18:01:55 GMT
I think if Bynum played for the Raptors (and Bosh did not) I could easily see him being a 20 and 10 guy. Ultimately I don't think Bosh is a true franchise player, he is somewhere between that and a team's #2 player. Anyway, if this trade was made 20 games in and the Raptors record was like 7-13 and it was only for Bosh then I would accept. But Hedo Turkoglu isn't tainted in a sim league. In real life he was blamed for basically all the Raps faults. He absolutely underachieved but not to the point that it has been portrayed. He is too good to just be dumped. This team has a good chance of making a noticeable playoff run and having Bosh resign and going from there. I think it is too early to assume Bosh will leave town and Turk is too good for me to accept this.
Declined.
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